Tuesday, July 03, 2007
I keep trying to get out...
Comments:
It's somewhat alarming just how unprofessional the Oilers management can be. The past three years have been a gongshow of screwups -- how can they still be intact? It's an old boys club, nothing but loyalty to eachother matters...pretty amusing to an outsider, infuriating to a true Oiler fan.
The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans. I guess that explains why no one is posting here right now.
The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans.
That angle hasn't been covered enough. Of course, I can't say it without choking on my own vomit.
try not get down gentlemen.. the Oilers 'took care' of their core last summer..and look where we are now..*expletive*
Bwa Ha Ha
I have to say that I am confused.
In 05-06 Kevin Lowe was a genius. The best GM since Sam Pollack. He acquired Shitface Cockfuck (cockface shitfuck? I can't remember now) for pennies, he signed Peca (which seemed like a brilliant move at the time and who was pretty good in the Cup run), made some nice mid season trades, grabbed 5-holoson at the deadline and generally seemed like a man on the ball. In fact, he should have been the NHL GM of the year (do they have such an award?)
Since that glorious 7th game however, he has been (admit it) a lesser GM than Garth Snow. He traded SFCF for magic beans, accomplished nada in the '06 UFA market, steered a proud franchise to one of the worst quarters in NHL history in early '07 and his big '07 signing is a backup goalie. HELLO? TheOilers already have the best backup goalie in the entire NHL. Unfortunately, he is the starter.
So what happened? Conspiracy theorists demand an answer? Is K-Lo working for Jim Ballsillie? Frankly, it is the only explanation that makes sense to me right now.
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... Hamilton Oilers ..............
In lighter news, apparently, the Wild signed "DOAN! DOAN! DOAN! DOAN!" to a one-year deal on Monday. Where was all the coverage of this?
Brad Stuart signed for 3.5.. doesn't he need a new agent?
No, because it's only a one-year deal. What almost certainly happened is that the big money, long-term offers he anticipated never materialized, so he thought it would be better to spend the next season trying to increase his value, and try the market again in '08. Perfectly reasonable strategy; the Oilers should approach Sheldon Souray with a similar offer.
So what happened?
The Oilers stopped winning; I can't really say Lowe did anything appreciably different from what he has been doing for years. In fact, the return on the Pronger trade is more or less in line with what he got for Doug Weight in 2001 (Jochen Hecht, Marty Reasoner, and Jan Horacek). The only difference is that he had acquired more NHL-ready players in deals for Weight, Guerin, and Hamrlik (Hecht, Carter, and Brewer, respectively). By not replacing Pronger and Smyth with NHL-ready bodies, the team was bound to drop off. Add in the losses to injuries, and a dramatic drop-off was inevitable.
Check out this Oilers fan site. It has a list of every trade made during Kevin Lowe's tenure.
doogie, will you lay off Kelly? If it wasn't for the shitty Oilfans ragging on him unfairly for not being Doan or Pronger or Gretzky or whatever great player he replaced, he'd have been a legit number one.
Because we all know that attitude, hard work, and fan appreciation is all that's needed for a shitty hockey player to become a good one.
So does this mean that Bonsignore is coming back too? Another misjudged kid who never had a chance, in my opinion.
TheOilers already have the best backup goalie in the entire NHL. Unfortunately, he is the starter
I know the phrase LOL is overused, but seriously -- thank you for that.
The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans.
Oh yah, locking down the core that has steered as to two glorious first round exits was a wonderful move. Personally, I would have loved to have seen Regehr traded. He's so overrated it's not even funny. Look at his twin Stuart he managed to grab himself $3.5M in his prime. In a league that is increasingly moving away from slow footed guys who are only effective in the corners, to medium size guys who can move their feet and pass the puck, guys like Regehr and Stuart are fucking dinosaurs.
Why the hell would we want some lug that can't move on our team? These days all he's going to do is take penalties and put himself out of position. What you need now is a guy who can quickly move around the zone and take away passing angles and space. When you could go around destroying people and wrapping your stick around opponents waist when you got beat, guys like Regehr and Stuart were great. But now that you can't take a guy out without taking a penalty and actually have to move your feet a little, these guys are useless. Trust me. The only thing I like about the Regehr deal is that we "underpaid him."
I'm not buying it Alex. The Oilers did not exactly have a recent tradition of winning when they hooked Pronger and Peca, 2 of the most desireable acquisitions of the summer of '05. But they did have some recent success by the summer of '06 when half their roster wanted to leave and Lowe added nothing of substance to replace them.
Sure, there were injuries, but the 06-07 team was never as good as the 05-06 side, injuries or not.
There is something fundamentally wrong there. The players collectively are big gossips and it seems none of them want to play for the Oilers.
Peter, would you like to examine the Flames "success" since the lockout? It seems only fair, doesn't it?
I'm curious if other Flames fans feel the same as Mclea about Regehr.
mclea: Blaming our 1st round exit last season on Regehr (and subsequently building a post commenting on how he is essentially ineffective in this "new nhl") is classic. Thank you very, very much for that. You were clearly playing close attention.
Here's a simple, innocent question: which slow moving dinosaur who is only effective in the corners lead the team in +/- last year?
Hey! Nice blog! Just wanted to tell you, when you write new blog posts, go over to BeTheRef.com and post a link to your story, and hopefully get a few extra readers for your blog. Take care and have a great week!
Maclea's criticism is preposterous. Regehr plays the toughest minutes on the team and, I'd argue, is their most valuable player after Kiprusoff. They were lost when he was out of the lineup in 05/06...and were just as lost when he was hurt against Detroit. He's the anchor.
Someone with more initiative than me should calculate W-L for the spans he's been injured. Of course, staying healthy is part of the package, and I guess that's the big fear with our current D corps.
doogie, will you lay off Kelly? If it wasn't for the shitty Oilfans ragging on him unfairly for not being Doan or Pronger or Gretzky or whatever great player he replaced, he'd have been a legit number one.
Sorry, I missed the part where he flourished outside Edmonton. The dude's a career minor-leaguer, and it was a bad pick when there were obviously better players available. Everyone in Edmonton knew it then, and we still know it now.
Jesus, Andy, how broad does sarcasm have to be around here? I need a tutorial from a master. No emoticons though, please.
But we all got a link to Kelly's stellar career out of it, so it's all good.
Interesting that Radek Dvorak is Cosh's grandma's pick on the same draft: no Doan, but no frickin' disaster either.
I'm not buying it Alex. The Oilers did not exactly have a recent tradition of winning when they hooked Pronger and Peca, 2 of the most desireable acquisitions of the summer of '05. But they did have some recent success by the summer of '06 when half their roster wanted to leave and Lowe added nothing of substance to replace them.
I think that was Alex's point.
Lowe has kept the same basic approach for years. He wasn't a better GM in 05/06, or a worse one in 06/07. He tried to do the same thing both years - it just paid off one year, and didn't the next.
Perhaps Lowe is the same GM, but it just seems to me that something is wrong. Even after the great playoff run in '06, everyone wanted to leave the team and no one wanted to join it. This seems to be the case now.
This might not be a Kevin Lowe issue, but something is clearly wrong. Hockey players should want to play in Edmonton, given its history and all. I can't understand why they don't.
Here's a simple, innocent question: which slow moving dinosaur who is only effective in the corners lead the team in +/- last year?
Did you just drop +/- on me? Get a clue.
I'd argue, is their most valuable player after Kiprusoff.
Man, if you think Regehr is our second best player you aren't even worth arguing with. I swear to God that hockey is the only sport in the universe where people can watch it religiously for years and still not understand it in the slightest.
I swear to God that hockey is the only sport in the universe where people can watch it religiously for years and still not understand it in the slightest.
I nominate this post for the most condescending comment (sports division) this year.
I nominate this post for the most condescending comment (sports division) this year.
Ya, that was pretty bad. But if you don't think it's true, than either you haven't lived in Vancouver, or you haven't hung out on the internets long enough.
mclea: I didn't say best. I said valuable to the team. We're awful when he doesn’t play. Or do you have some magical way of watching hockey that transcends score at the end of the game? (For comparison, check our record during the stretch Iginla missed last season.) And while I agree that +/- isn’t any kind of be all end all, it’s a reasonable indication that he does a comparatively good job against the other team’s best players. There’s not a D man in the league who doesn’t get beat a couple of times a game (forget about the ones that make less than $4M/season). It’s the way Regehr mitigates what happens after faster players get around him. His positioning is exceptional. Or do you actually believe the NHL’s brimming with fleet footed shut down defensemen?
Also: in the NHL I watched last season, the one where teams had to kill occasional penalties, an ability to muscle out traffic from in front of the net was not an irrelevant ability.
And none of this takes into consideration the guy didn’t play with a steady partner last season either.
Okay; bad news: a lot of free agents don't want to play in Edmonton. good news: maybe this'll force the Oil to draft and sign some western canadian talent. I'm not saying you have to have a Euro-free zone, but if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron.
I'm not saying you have to have a Euro-free zone, but if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron.
I'm sorry, I must have been busy ingesting hallucinogens and listening to fifteen minute Neil Young guitar riffs when "best" was becoming synonymous with "most western Canadian".
Also, "if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron" is one of those phrases that's virtually unusable outside of the sporting world. Also inside the sporting world, were there any justice.
I'm pretty sure he was agreeing with you, Doogie.
My sarcasm detector must be broken. My bad.
Perhaps Lowe is the same GM, but it just seems to me that something is wrong. Even after the great playoff run in '06, everyone wanted to leave the team and no one wanted to join it. This seems to be the case now.
This might not be a Kevin Lowe issue, but something is clearly wrong. Hockey players should want to play in Edmonton, given its history and all. I can't understand why they don't.
I think you can thank Chris Pronger for that. Amazing what having your best player up and fuck off on you does for your team's reputation. Of course, that tradition also cuts both ways, and I think Edmonton can be like a smaller version of Toronto and Montreal in some ways.
Yes, that was effectively the point I was trying to make - Lowe's strategy hasn't changed, but it hasn't been as effective as it once was.
As for attracting players, there has to be more to it than the Pronger incident. Before the lockout, players used to talk glowingly about Edmonton. Maybe they were just playing nice, but I wonder what if anything has fundamentally changed.
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It's somewhat alarming just how unprofessional the Oilers management can be. The past three years have been a gongshow of screwups -- how can they still be intact? It's an old boys club, nothing but loyalty to eachother matters...pretty amusing to an outsider, infuriating to a true Oiler fan.
The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans. I guess that explains why no one is posting here right now.
The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans.
That angle hasn't been covered enough. Of course, I can't say it without choking on my own vomit.
try not get down gentlemen.. the Oilers 'took care' of their core last summer..and look where we are now..*expletive*
Bwa Ha Ha
I have to say that I am confused.
In 05-06 Kevin Lowe was a genius. The best GM since Sam Pollack. He acquired Shitface Cockfuck (cockface shitfuck? I can't remember now) for pennies, he signed Peca (which seemed like a brilliant move at the time and who was pretty good in the Cup run), made some nice mid season trades, grabbed 5-holoson at the deadline and generally seemed like a man on the ball. In fact, he should have been the NHL GM of the year (do they have such an award?)
Since that glorious 7th game however, he has been (admit it) a lesser GM than Garth Snow. He traded SFCF for magic beans, accomplished nada in the '06 UFA market, steered a proud franchise to one of the worst quarters in NHL history in early '07 and his big '07 signing is a backup goalie. HELLO? TheOilers already have the best backup goalie in the entire NHL. Unfortunately, he is the starter.
So what happened? Conspiracy theorists demand an answer? Is K-Lo working for Jim Ballsillie? Frankly, it is the only explanation that makes sense to me right now.
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... Hamilton Oilers ..............
# posted by 
: July 04, 2007 1:47 pm
: July 04, 2007 1:47 pm In lighter news, apparently, the Wild signed "DOAN! DOAN! DOAN! DOAN!" to a one-year deal on Monday. Where was all the coverage of this?
Brad Stuart signed for 3.5.. doesn't he need a new agent?
No, because it's only a one-year deal. What almost certainly happened is that the big money, long-term offers he anticipated never materialized, so he thought it would be better to spend the next season trying to increase his value, and try the market again in '08. Perfectly reasonable strategy; the Oilers should approach Sheldon Souray with a similar offer.
So what happened?
The Oilers stopped winning; I can't really say Lowe did anything appreciably different from what he has been doing for years. In fact, the return on the Pronger trade is more or less in line with what he got for Doug Weight in 2001 (Jochen Hecht, Marty Reasoner, and Jan Horacek). The only difference is that he had acquired more NHL-ready players in deals for Weight, Guerin, and Hamrlik (Hecht, Carter, and Brewer, respectively). By not replacing Pronger and Smyth with NHL-ready bodies, the team was bound to drop off. Add in the losses to injuries, and a dramatic drop-off was inevitable.
Check out this Oilers fan site. It has a list of every trade made during Kevin Lowe's tenure.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 3:06 pm
: July 04, 2007 3:06 pm doogie, will you lay off Kelly? If it wasn't for the shitty Oilfans ragging on him unfairly for not being Doan or Pronger or Gretzky or whatever great player he replaced, he'd have been a legit number one.
Because we all know that attitude, hard work, and fan appreciation is all that's needed for a shitty hockey player to become a good one.
So does this mean that Bonsignore is coming back too? Another misjudged kid who never had a chance, in my opinion.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 3:10 pm
: July 04, 2007 3:10 pm TheOilers already have the best backup goalie in the entire NHL. Unfortunately, he is the starter
I know the phrase LOL is overused, but seriously -- thank you for that.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 3:55 pm
: July 04, 2007 3:55 pm The fact that this happened at the same time as the Flames intelligently took care of their core team components with long-term contracts (Iginla, Regehr) is a bit like rubbing salt in the wound for many Oil fans.
Oh yah, locking down the core that has steered as to two glorious first round exits was a wonderful move. Personally, I would have loved to have seen Regehr traded. He's so overrated it's not even funny. Look at his twin Stuart he managed to grab himself $3.5M in his prime. In a league that is increasingly moving away from slow footed guys who are only effective in the corners, to medium size guys who can move their feet and pass the puck, guys like Regehr and Stuart are fucking dinosaurs.
Why the hell would we want some lug that can't move on our team? These days all he's going to do is take penalties and put himself out of position. What you need now is a guy who can quickly move around the zone and take away passing angles and space. When you could go around destroying people and wrapping your stick around opponents waist when you got beat, guys like Regehr and Stuart were great. But now that you can't take a guy out without taking a penalty and actually have to move your feet a little, these guys are useless. Trust me. The only thing I like about the Regehr deal is that we "underpaid him."
I'm not buying it Alex. The Oilers did not exactly have a recent tradition of winning when they hooked Pronger and Peca, 2 of the most desireable acquisitions of the summer of '05. But they did have some recent success by the summer of '06 when half their roster wanted to leave and Lowe added nothing of substance to replace them.
Sure, there were injuries, but the 06-07 team was never as good as the 05-06 side, injuries or not.
There is something fundamentally wrong there. The players collectively are big gossips and it seems none of them want to play for the Oilers.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 4:24 pm
: July 04, 2007 4:24 pm Peter, would you like to examine the Flames "success" since the lockout? It seems only fair, doesn't it?
I'm curious if other Flames fans feel the same as Mclea about Regehr.
mclea: Blaming our 1st round exit last season on Regehr (and subsequently building a post commenting on how he is essentially ineffective in this "new nhl") is classic. Thank you very, very much for that. You were clearly playing close attention.
Here's a simple, innocent question: which slow moving dinosaur who is only effective in the corners lead the team in +/- last year?
Hey! Nice blog! Just wanted to tell you, when you write new blog posts, go over to BeTheRef.com and post a link to your story, and hopefully get a few extra readers for your blog. Take care and have a great week!
# posted by : July 04, 2007 5:28 pm
: July 04, 2007 5:28 pm Maclea's criticism is preposterous. Regehr plays the toughest minutes on the team and, I'd argue, is their most valuable player after Kiprusoff. They were lost when he was out of the lineup in 05/06...and were just as lost when he was hurt against Detroit. He's the anchor.
Someone with more initiative than me should calculate W-L for the spans he's been injured. Of course, staying healthy is part of the package, and I guess that's the big fear with our current D corps.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 6:11 pm
: July 04, 2007 6:11 pm doogie, will you lay off Kelly? If it wasn't for the shitty Oilfans ragging on him unfairly for not being Doan or Pronger or Gretzky or whatever great player he replaced, he'd have been a legit number one.
Sorry, I missed the part where he flourished outside Edmonton. The dude's a career minor-leaguer, and it was a bad pick when there were obviously better players available. Everyone in Edmonton knew it then, and we still know it now.
Jesus, Andy, how broad does sarcasm have to be around here? I need a tutorial from a master. No emoticons though, please.
But we all got a link to Kelly's stellar career out of it, so it's all good.
Interesting that Radek Dvorak is Cosh's grandma's pick on the same draft: no Doan, but no frickin' disaster either.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 9:02 pm
: July 04, 2007 9:02 pm I'm not buying it Alex. The Oilers did not exactly have a recent tradition of winning when they hooked Pronger and Peca, 2 of the most desireable acquisitions of the summer of '05. But they did have some recent success by the summer of '06 when half their roster wanted to leave and Lowe added nothing of substance to replace them.
I think that was Alex's point.
Lowe has kept the same basic approach for years. He wasn't a better GM in 05/06, or a worse one in 06/07. He tried to do the same thing both years - it just paid off one year, and didn't the next.
Perhaps Lowe is the same GM, but it just seems to me that something is wrong. Even after the great playoff run in '06, everyone wanted to leave the team and no one wanted to join it. This seems to be the case now.
This might not be a Kevin Lowe issue, but something is clearly wrong. Hockey players should want to play in Edmonton, given its history and all. I can't understand why they don't.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 9:45 pm
: July 04, 2007 9:45 pm Here's a simple, innocent question: which slow moving dinosaur who is only effective in the corners lead the team in +/- last year?
Did you just drop +/- on me? Get a clue.
I'd argue, is their most valuable player after Kiprusoff.
Man, if you think Regehr is our second best player you aren't even worth arguing with. I swear to God that hockey is the only sport in the universe where people can watch it religiously for years and still not understand it in the slightest.
I swear to God that hockey is the only sport in the universe where people can watch it religiously for years and still not understand it in the slightest.
I nominate this post for the most condescending comment (sports division) this year.
# posted by : July 04, 2007 11:33 pm
: July 04, 2007 11:33 pm I nominate this post for the most condescending comment (sports division) this year.
Ya, that was pretty bad. But if you don't think it's true, than either you haven't lived in Vancouver, or you haven't hung out on the internets long enough.
mclea: I didn't say best. I said valuable to the team. We're awful when he doesn’t play. Or do you have some magical way of watching hockey that transcends score at the end of the game? (For comparison, check our record during the stretch Iginla missed last season.) And while I agree that +/- isn’t any kind of be all end all, it’s a reasonable indication that he does a comparatively good job against the other team’s best players. There’s not a D man in the league who doesn’t get beat a couple of times a game (forget about the ones that make less than $4M/season). It’s the way Regehr mitigates what happens after faster players get around him. His positioning is exceptional. Or do you actually believe the NHL’s brimming with fleet footed shut down defensemen?
Also: in the NHL I watched last season, the one where teams had to kill occasional penalties, an ability to muscle out traffic from in front of the net was not an irrelevant ability.
And none of this takes into consideration the guy didn’t play with a steady partner last season either.
# posted by : July 05, 2007 2:28 am
: July 05, 2007 2:28 am Okay; bad news: a lot of free agents don't want to play in Edmonton. good news: maybe this'll force the Oil to draft and sign some western canadian talent. I'm not saying you have to have a Euro-free zone, but if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron.
# posted by : July 05, 2007 3:20 am
: July 05, 2007 3:20 am I'm not saying you have to have a Euro-free zone, but if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron.
I'm sorry, I must have been busy ingesting hallucinogens and listening to fifteen minute Neil Young guitar riffs when "best" was becoming synonymous with "most western Canadian".
Also, "if you want the best steel, you start with the best iron" is one of those phrases that's virtually unusable outside of the sporting world. Also inside the sporting world, were there any justice.
I'm pretty sure he was agreeing with you, Doogie.
My sarcasm detector must be broken. My bad.
Perhaps Lowe is the same GM, but it just seems to me that something is wrong. Even after the great playoff run in '06, everyone wanted to leave the team and no one wanted to join it. This seems to be the case now.
This might not be a Kevin Lowe issue, but something is clearly wrong. Hockey players should want to play in Edmonton, given its history and all. I can't understand why they don't.
I think you can thank Chris Pronger for that. Amazing what having your best player up and fuck off on you does for your team's reputation. Of course, that tradition also cuts both ways, and I think Edmonton can be like a smaller version of Toronto and Montreal in some ways.
Yes, that was effectively the point I was trying to make - Lowe's strategy hasn't changed, but it hasn't been as effective as it once was.
As for attracting players, there has to be more to it than the Pronger incident. Before the lockout, players used to talk glowingly about Edmonton. Maybe they were just playing nice, but I wonder what if anything has fundamentally changed.
# posted by : July 05, 2007 10:16 am
: July 05, 2007 10:16 am Post a Comment
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