Friday, June 30, 2006
Potpourri for $44M please, Alex
**I'm trying to figure out what's going on in Canuckland. Signing the Sedins, acquiring and signing Luongo, this is good stuff, right? Then I took a boo at their salary numbers. The Canucks have:
Q. Can you guess what their payroll would be if they simply signed 8 more forwards and 5 more defensemen for the league minimum?
A. $38 million dollars.
Aie, aie aie. If you assume Nonis has to reserve a bare minimum of $1M on Opening Night (injury replacements, callups, etc.), that leaves him $5M to upgrade 13 roster slots from the default state of Minimum Salary Player.
I'm not sure how he manages it (well, yes I am -- they dress a lot of rookies and journeymen). A Cloutier "giveaway" (e.g. for a draft pick) makes that number $7M, but that still doesn't sound like much.
I have to guess that not only Cloutier, but probably Morrison can be had by another GM for much less than "full value", so long as they don't need to send salary back to Nonis. (Hell, possibly even Naslund, though I would expect the Canucks would need close to full value for him.)
Luongo makes any team considerably better. Naslund and the Sedins are excellent players, and Ohlund/Salo is a nice top pair. But unless Dave Nonis figures out a way to fill out his roster with something more than assorted dregs, rejects, and unproven rookies, I won't be too panicky about the Canucks overtaking the Flames this season.
**Now It Can Be Told: what an awesome tale. Well done Black Dog.
**Mike Lange: fired as Penguins TV PbyP-man. Too bad; I always thought that Mario/Jagr highlights were about 25% more exciting with the "He beat 'im like a rented mule!" voiceover.
**And local cult favourite D-Vo won't be back with the Oilers, presumably because he was insulted by K-Lo's opening offer. I fear slightly for Sacamano's emotional well-being -- remember, he's hanging out in Siberia thinking that the Oil still has Four Bullets left.
- 5 forwards under contract (Naslund, Morrison, Cooke, Sedin x2)
- 2 defensemen under contract (Ohlund, Salo)
- 2 goalies under contract (Luongo, Cloutier)
Q. Can you guess what their payroll would be if they simply signed 8 more forwards and 5 more defensemen for the league minimum?
A. $38 million dollars.
Aie, aie aie. If you assume Nonis has to reserve a bare minimum of $1M on Opening Night (injury replacements, callups, etc.), that leaves him $5M to upgrade 13 roster slots from the default state of Minimum Salary Player.
I'm not sure how he manages it (well, yes I am -- they dress a lot of rookies and journeymen). A Cloutier "giveaway" (e.g. for a draft pick) makes that number $7M, but that still doesn't sound like much.
I have to guess that not only Cloutier, but probably Morrison can be had by another GM for much less than "full value", so long as they don't need to send salary back to Nonis. (Hell, possibly even Naslund, though I would expect the Canucks would need close to full value for him.)
Luongo makes any team considerably better. Naslund and the Sedins are excellent players, and Ohlund/Salo is a nice top pair. But unless Dave Nonis figures out a way to fill out his roster with something more than assorted dregs, rejects, and unproven rookies, I won't be too panicky about the Canucks overtaking the Flames this season.
**Now It Can Be Told: what an awesome tale. Well done Black Dog.
**Mike Lange: fired as Penguins TV PbyP-man. Too bad; I always thought that Mario/Jagr highlights were about 25% more exciting with the "He beat 'im like a rented mule!" voiceover.
**And local cult favourite D-Vo won't be back with the Oilers, presumably because he was insulted by K-Lo's opening offer. I fear slightly for Sacamano's emotional well-being -- remember, he's hanging out in Siberia thinking that the Oil still has Four Bullets left.
# posted by Matt @ 1:35 pm 
Comments:
Wow, didn't realize they were already against it like that.
They will move Cloutier.
But no Jovo, I guess? And Carter?
Yeesh.
Naslund better score 70.
The Canucks D consists of Ohlund, Salo, Carney (probably), Baumgartner, rookie Luc Bourdon, Lukas Krajicek and Wade Brookbank.
That's without Jovo, and assuming Weinrich is gone-zo...
Not a bad group at all.
We played hide and seek with the Cap all season, and I'm sure this year will be no different. I think the Canucks will be every bit as good as the Flames.
The Canucks will be better than the Flames! Bet on it, Matt. You fear Luongo! He's even better than Kipper!
how much is ur team paying iginla again?
Boy, did you ever miss the point.
Ohlund, Salo, Carney (probably), Baumgartner, rookie Luc Bourdon, Lukas Krajicek and Wade Brookbank.
Not a bad group. Certainly not a good group either:
Ohlund and Salo, yeah they're good. Carney won't be back. And the rest? Unless Bourdon is another Phaneuf, you're in trouble (didn't Brookbank play forward sometimes?).
You fear Luongo! He's even better than Kipper!
Luongo's a very good goalie..but even he can't save a team when they have no defense (see: roster above and Florida's record with Luongo in net).
Well, they do have Noronen, so they can let Cloutier go for a minor-leaguer and/or a pick. Still, no Jovo presents a problem, as could no Carter for the Sedins, and you know Carter's going for at least $3M, which is half their "upgrade" budget right there.
Why am I sensing that Canucks schadenfreude may be the very thing that keeps me going until Prongergate and the UFA dance sort themselves out?
Grabia,
There's been a lot of talk in various circles about Nonis dealing Naslund ( Golbez mentions it today), which would make sense, especially considering how much shuffling the 'Nucks had to do last year just to stay under cap (ie sending minor leaugers up and down without ever having played a game). It makes sense, considering the emergence of the Sedins and the cap issue: two 2.5-3mil players for Naslund more or less make up your second line.
With this year's jump in the salary cap, it's lookng like this year's crop of FA are scoring (the RFAs seem to be doing well securing good $ long term deals). If the cap doesn't move much next year (ie the upcoming year is a correction from under-estimating the first year cap) will there be anywhere near as much money to go around?
I know that is looking ahead, but there have been some surprising contracts this year, and teams can't just eat bad inflated contracts (I'm looking at you Leafs).
Is this going to take 10 years like the NFL did to figure out how to 'manage' cap space?
"Luongo's a very good goalie..but even he can't save a team when they have no defense (see: roster above and Florida's record with Luongo in net)."
But Florida would give up an NHL record amount of shots.
Bourdon could be the next Phaneuf
Almost any D is good if it is coached right. Comparing Crawford and Vigneault's styles is like comparing hookers to church girls.
Pleasure Motors,
Was there a reason you addressed me specifically? I didn't write the post, so I am just wondering if I did something wrong. But yes, I had heard stuff last week even about how they might move Naslund. Are you suggesting that I suggest we get him? Because it won't happen. The suggesting, that is. I hate Markus Naslund. Not as much as I hate Thomas Kaberle, mind you. But I do hate Markus Naslund.
Not a bad group. Certainly not a good group either:
Ohlund and Salo, yeah they're good. Carney won't be back. And the rest? Unless Bourdon is another Phaneuf, you're in trouble (didn't Brookbank play forward sometimes?).
I'd say their D is a damned sight better than the D in Florida (heh, including Krajicek!) Bouwmeester and Van Ryn aren't as good as Ohlund and Salo. Who needs D anyways when you have Luongo?
The last thing that really concerns me with the Canucks is Anson Carter. We spent 3.5 million on each Sedin, and Carter (who scored more goals) has got to be equal in value to them. I'd be extremely disappointed if Carter walked away, because it took five bloody years to find a linemate that clicked with the Twins. I have no desire to wait that long again.
Zanstorm is right on one thing (lo the pathetic Leafs fan that he is): Vignault will emphasize defensive responsibilty with the forwards, something that was sadly lacking under Crawford.
Getting Tanguay sure was sweet for the Flames. He'd look dang good in a Canucks uniform. Also, has anyone heard what Calgary is doing with Amonte? Have they even offered to pack his bags for him?
I'll start a rumour or make a suggestion anyway.
Naslund to Toronto.
Has not been mentioned here at all (in t.o. that is).
But the Leafs have space in their budget, Sundin needs a winger now that Jonus Hoglund has returned to Sweden and the Leafs have a few cheap players that might interest the Canucks for their D/3rd line. Or maybe Tucker.
Just a thought. I don't think the Leafs have the chips unless its a straight salary dump by Nonis.
If Nonis did pull the trigger on Nazzy, I think there would be a much bigger outcry in Vancouver than there was for Bertuzzi, and keep in mind, the fans in Van City were behind Bert all season. We'd have a get some high class players in return, and I'm afraid there is no one on the Leafs roster that fits that desciption.
If Nonis was going to simply dump salary, I think he'd look at a some of the lesser productive guys like Cooke (1.5 mill and injury prone) and Linden (1.5 mill and playing 10-12 minutes per game).
temujin - agreed on that - unless Nonis has something cooking - ie/ bringing in another big name - its likely not going to happen
and you are right - unless its a straight out salary dump the Leafs have nothing the Canucks would want
How come nobody's fungoed the possibility of Kaberle/Tucker coming this way in a Pronger deal, anyway? That was the first mention of Tucker I've heard in weeks, and Dog has him going to Vancouver.
Naslund isn't going anywhere yet. If anything he'll whine and cry his sorry ass all the way back to Sweden. He has suggested he'll go back there anyways.
Haha, none of you can have Tucker! No way! He bleeds blue and white.
Pronger for Tucker and Kaberle is a good suggestion, but I wouldn't do it if I was JFJ. But the Oilers could sure use some bonafide second line scoring to complement Pisani, who was just signed for 4 years by the way
Graby, you missed Linden, who makes the situation uglier with his $1.5-million next year.
Cloutier is as good as gone, however.
Pronger for Tucker and Kaberle is a good suggestion, but I wouldn't do it if I was JFJ.
I wouldn't rule out some kind of sweetener from our side to finish a deal like that.
Who needs D anyways when you have Luongo?
Say hello to fifty-shot nights every other game with that attitude. His save percentage will still rock, but his GAA will be absolute shit, and his record will be about 20-35-4.
Was there a reason you addressed me specifically?
Yes. That reason is because the letters m, a, t and t, when put together in that sequence, bear a striking resemblence to the name "andy grabia."
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Wow, didn't realize they were already against it like that.
They will move Cloutier.
But no Jovo, I guess? And Carter?
Yeesh.
Naslund better score 70.
The Canucks D consists of Ohlund, Salo, Carney (probably), Baumgartner, rookie Luc Bourdon, Lukas Krajicek and Wade Brookbank.
That's without Jovo, and assuming Weinrich is gone-zo...
Not a bad group at all.
We played hide and seek with the Cap all season, and I'm sure this year will be no different. I think the Canucks will be every bit as good as the Flames.
The Canucks will be better than the Flames! Bet on it, Matt. You fear Luongo! He's even better than Kipper!
# posted by 
: June 30, 2006 2:59 pm
: June 30, 2006 2:59 pm how much is ur team paying iginla again?
Boy, did you ever miss the point.
Ohlund, Salo, Carney (probably), Baumgartner, rookie Luc Bourdon, Lukas Krajicek and Wade Brookbank.
Not a bad group. Certainly not a good group either:
Ohlund and Salo, yeah they're good. Carney won't be back. And the rest? Unless Bourdon is another Phaneuf, you're in trouble (didn't Brookbank play forward sometimes?).
You fear Luongo! He's even better than Kipper!
Luongo's a very good goalie..but even he can't save a team when they have no defense (see: roster above and Florida's record with Luongo in net).
Well, they do have Noronen, so they can let Cloutier go for a minor-leaguer and/or a pick. Still, no Jovo presents a problem, as could no Carter for the Sedins, and you know Carter's going for at least $3M, which is half their "upgrade" budget right there.
Why am I sensing that Canucks schadenfreude may be the very thing that keeps me going until Prongergate and the UFA dance sort themselves out?
# posted by : June 30, 2006 3:18 pm
: June 30, 2006 3:18 pm Grabia,
There's been a lot of talk in various circles about Nonis dealing Naslund ( Golbez mentions it today), which would make sense, especially considering how much shuffling the 'Nucks had to do last year just to stay under cap (ie sending minor leaugers up and down without ever having played a game). It makes sense, considering the emergence of the Sedins and the cap issue: two 2.5-3mil players for Naslund more or less make up your second line.
With this year's jump in the salary cap, it's lookng like this year's crop of FA are scoring (the RFAs seem to be doing well securing good $ long term deals). If the cap doesn't move much next year (ie the upcoming year is a correction from under-estimating the first year cap) will there be anywhere near as much money to go around?
I know that is looking ahead, but there have been some surprising contracts this year, and teams can't just eat bad inflated contracts (I'm looking at you Leafs).
Is this going to take 10 years like the NFL did to figure out how to 'manage' cap space?
# posted by : June 30, 2006 4:29 pm
: June 30, 2006 4:29 pm "Luongo's a very good goalie..but even he can't save a team when they have no defense (see: roster above and Florida's record with Luongo in net)."
But Florida would give up an NHL record amount of shots.
Bourdon could be the next Phaneuf
Almost any D is good if it is coached right. Comparing Crawford and Vigneault's styles is like comparing hookers to church girls.
# posted by : June 30, 2006 4:40 pm
: June 30, 2006 4:40 pm Pleasure Motors,
Was there a reason you addressed me specifically? I didn't write the post, so I am just wondering if I did something wrong. But yes, I had heard stuff last week even about how they might move Naslund. Are you suggesting that I suggest we get him? Because it won't happen. The suggesting, that is. I hate Markus Naslund. Not as much as I hate Thomas Kaberle, mind you. But I do hate Markus Naslund.
Not a bad group. Certainly not a good group either:
Ohlund and Salo, yeah they're good. Carney won't be back. And the rest? Unless Bourdon is another Phaneuf, you're in trouble (didn't Brookbank play forward sometimes?).
I'd say their D is a damned sight better than the D in Florida (heh, including Krajicek!) Bouwmeester and Van Ryn aren't as good as Ohlund and Salo. Who needs D anyways when you have Luongo?
The last thing that really concerns me with the Canucks is Anson Carter. We spent 3.5 million on each Sedin, and Carter (who scored more goals) has got to be equal in value to them. I'd be extremely disappointed if Carter walked away, because it took five bloody years to find a linemate that clicked with the Twins. I have no desire to wait that long again.
Zanstorm is right on one thing (lo the pathetic Leafs fan that he is): Vignault will emphasize defensive responsibilty with the forwards, something that was sadly lacking under Crawford.
Getting Tanguay sure was sweet for the Flames. He'd look dang good in a Canucks uniform. Also, has anyone heard what Calgary is doing with Amonte? Have they even offered to pack his bags for him?
I'll start a rumour or make a suggestion anyway.
Naslund to Toronto.
Has not been mentioned here at all (in t.o. that is).
But the Leafs have space in their budget, Sundin needs a winger now that Jonus Hoglund has returned to Sweden and the Leafs have a few cheap players that might interest the Canucks for their D/3rd line. Or maybe Tucker.
Just a thought. I don't think the Leafs have the chips unless its a straight salary dump by Nonis.
If Nonis did pull the trigger on Nazzy, I think there would be a much bigger outcry in Vancouver than there was for Bertuzzi, and keep in mind, the fans in Van City were behind Bert all season. We'd have a get some high class players in return, and I'm afraid there is no one on the Leafs roster that fits that desciption.
If Nonis was going to simply dump salary, I think he'd look at a some of the lesser productive guys like Cooke (1.5 mill and injury prone) and Linden (1.5 mill and playing 10-12 minutes per game).
temujin - agreed on that - unless Nonis has something cooking - ie/ bringing in another big name - its likely not going to happen
and you are right - unless its a straight out salary dump the Leafs have nothing the Canucks would want
How come nobody's fungoed the possibility of Kaberle/Tucker coming this way in a Pronger deal, anyway? That was the first mention of Tucker I've heard in weeks, and Dog has him going to Vancouver.
# posted by : June 30, 2006 8:09 pm
: June 30, 2006 8:09 pm Naslund isn't going anywhere yet. If anything he'll whine and cry his sorry ass all the way back to Sweden. He has suggested he'll go back there anyways.
Haha, none of you can have Tucker! No way! He bleeds blue and white.
Pronger for Tucker and Kaberle is a good suggestion, but I wouldn't do it if I was JFJ. But the Oilers could sure use some bonafide second line scoring to complement Pisani, who was just signed for 4 years by the way
# posted by : June 30, 2006 9:23 pm
: June 30, 2006 9:23 pm Graby, you missed Linden, who makes the situation uglier with his $1.5-million next year.
Cloutier is as good as gone, however.
Pronger for Tucker and Kaberle is a good suggestion, but I wouldn't do it if I was JFJ.
I wouldn't rule out some kind of sweetener from our side to finish a deal like that.
# posted by : June 30, 2006 9:51 pm
: June 30, 2006 9:51 pm Who needs D anyways when you have Luongo?
Say hello to fifty-shot nights every other game with that attitude. His save percentage will still rock, but his GAA will be absolute shit, and his record will be about 20-35-4.
# posted by : July 01, 2006 10:31 am
: July 01, 2006 10:31 am Was there a reason you addressed me specifically?
Yes. That reason is because the letters m, a, t and t, when put together in that sequence, bear a striking resemblence to the name "andy grabia."
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